A "Duster" too far

[caz963]

If you read fic of any kind... you know how sometimes, you read something and think, "Oops. We/They would never say that"?

And how, sometimes, you think, "oh well, it's just a simple mistake." and don't let it spoil your enjoyment of the story?

But then you see the same mistake made by someone else. And this time, it jars a bit. But you again think "oh, well," and keep reading.

Then you see it in another fic.

And it jars even more.

And another.

And another... and another... and another... and...



http://community.livejournal.com/doctor_donna/1180746.html

ETA - one of the mods asked me to f-lock the post for some reason, so here's the gist.

I am fed up with seeing Ten's coat referred to (in the small amount of fic I DO read) as "a duster".

Because THIS -



is a DUSTER. A little yellow cloth that we use to polish stuff.

What Ten is wearing in this picture -



- is an overcoat or just a "coat".

(I know it's tough - but try to look at the coat in that picture, okay? Just for a second before your attention wanders elsewhere...)

A fairly long discussion has ensued with the majority of commenters agreeing with me :-)

I have never made any secret of the fact that I am a fic snob. ^{TM zinke}.

BUT I WOULD NEVER SPRAY MR. SHEEN ON THAT COAT AND ATTACK MY MANTLEPIECE WITH IT!!

*ahem*

And yes. I do have work to do. Why do you ask?!

Comments

[nostalgia-lj.livejournal.com]

I always get confused about which pants have been removed in porn.

Not that there is much D/D porn these days ;_;

[caz963.livejournal.com]

I'm sure there must be a fic about "polishing" just waiting to be written somewhere out there...

There isn't enough D/D pr0n. I am trying to add to it, but I write slower than a snail on a go slow :(

[nostalgia-lj.livejournal.com]

"He put his thing into her thing and they did the thing." There!

Eh, it is all G-rated and stuff that confuses me since her boobs alone are PG-13.

[canterlevi.livejournal.com]

Oh, Christ on crutches, nostalgia,I was eating my dinner when I read this post and the falafel was *this close* to coming out my nose.

:-)

Snerk!

[teresadivicenzo.livejournal.com]

This reminds me of when I went to see Groban on Paul O'Grady's show. The audience was full of Americans who were over and there was a feature on French Polishing. O'Grady was in fits of laughter and could barely get through it, as were all us Brits - we were crying with laughter - not one American got why until my mate stood up and did a wanker sign at Groban. His face was something I'll never forget. Ah, happy days.

[caz963.livejournal.com]

BWAHAHAHAH!!

It must be a "Carry On" thing, because even the mention of French polishing is making me snigger...

[teresadivicenzo.livejournal.com]

[topaz-eyes.livejournal.com]

I don't blame you one bit. I wish there were more fic snobs. For a British fandom, using British words and terms shouldn't be so hard.

(My personal annoyance is the word "luv" in Lie to Me fandom. Uhm. "Luv" isn't a real word. The way Tim Roth says "love", it sounds more long 'o' than short 'u' to my (non-British) ear. Yet... *grrrrr*)

BUT I WOULD NEVER SPRAY MR. SHEEN ON THAT COAT AND ATTACK MY MANTLEPIECE WITH IT!!

AHAHAHAHAHA that image is *priceless*!

[caz963.livejournal.com]

I'd never write the word "luv" in a fic, because as you say, it's not even a proper word! *g*

But we DO use "luv" as an "abbreviated"?? form of "love" and do pronounce it the way that TR does on LtM - the "u" sounding as in "under".

This is getting far too erudite. I'm trying to think of a dirty joke about dipthongs instead!

[hooloovoo_42]

So now it's locked, all of us who are not members of the comm can't see the comments we've already made. Is this a move to get us to join or to stop us from ranting?

[caz963.livejournal.com]

Dunno - but one of the mods asked me to lock it, so I did. It's not a moderated comm, so you can come and go at will.

[hooloovoo_42]

All the more reason not to lock it. But I'll drop by and complain there!

[caz963.livejournal.com]

Yeah - most people have taken it in the spirit in which I meant it. A good-natured grumble...

[hooloovoo_42]

Absolutely. Bit of cross culcheral exchange of info. There really aren't that many locked posts in there, so I'm at a loss. But I don't want to stay a member because I don't want a whole slew of DW fic I ain't gonna read blocking up my friends page.

[flippet.livejournal.com]

Amusing.

Yes, 'duster' in that sense is really only a Western US term.

So, unless the Tardis has set down somewhere in Wyoming....


It drives me nuts too. Usually the other way - scads of Britishisms running amok through West Wing fic. Terms that I actually generally have a lot of affection for.....just not coming out of Josh or Donna's mouth. :-/

[caz963.livejournal.com]

So, unless the Tardis has set down somewhere in Wyoming....


Oh, I'm sure it must've happened somewhere, somewhen! But even then, it's a British show and that's just not a word we use over here to describe an item of clothing.

What- you mean that Josh and Donna didn't have a rip-roaring, spiffing time of it working at that old White House? *g*

duster

[(Anonymous)]

Okay, well... the coat was given to him by Janis Joplin. Janis Joplin is from Texas. Hence, it could very well be a cowboy duster coat. I don't personally think it looks like one except for the length of it, but I could see why people might think so.

Heh.

(kitty, who can't remember her livejournal password)

Re: duster

[caz963.livejournal.com]

Okay, well... the coat was given to him by Janis Joplin.

Ah yes. But you've forgotten rule number one. The Doctor lies ;-)

Actually, the point I was trying to make was not whether the coat could legitimately be called a duster or not, but that we just don't use that term to describe a coat in the UK. It would be like me insisting on using "lift" instead of "elevator" in a fic in a US fandom. The thing might well be called a "lift", but you don't really use that term in the US.

(And I know that's a lame example, but it was the only one - other than trousers/pants - that I could come up with at short notice!)

[goldy-dollar.livejournal.com]

OH interesting! I don't think "duster" is used that often in Canadian English for "a long coat" but I definitely wouldn't have made the connection if I was reading a fic.

[lostakasha.livejournal.com]

Technically, Ten's coat could be called a duster if he was wearing it while splayed flat on his back on my dining room table, about to be ravaged. The table would have to be dusty, tho....

Yank here: My grandmother used to call housecoats 'dusters,' so I associate that word with something you'd wear while dusting. What do you call housecoats?

And I'm totally lost on the O'Grady clip, I think, unless French polishing is slang for a blow job...

[caz963.livejournal.com]

What do you call housecoats?

Um. Housecoats! ;)

unless French polishing is slang for a blow job...

Yep.

Being serious for one second - I know that the coat COULD be termed a duster; my point was that we don't use that term for it over here, and that whenever I see it written down, I think of the little yellow cloth.

I'd always make sure my table was full of dust if Ten visited, although it would play hell with my asthma! But some things are worth suffering for...

[zinke.livejournal.com]

You? A fic snob? Never. ;P

[caz963.livejournal.com]

I know! I can't think where anyone would get that impression...

[biodamped]

Heh. That post has since been deleted, i'm guessing. And the essence of it is why i stopped reading there - because too many people would post badly edited or totally unedited, out of character fic. I know it's a cruel thing to say, but it honestly isn't that hard to get a beta. Even a British beta! Especially when the members of that comm are (were? it's been a while since i was there) so friendly. But that and the cliquey wank that was going on behind the scenes really started to bother me. Fandom is supposed to be fun, there is no point to it otherwise.

(Also, unrelated: DW notified me you friended me. I'm not sure if you followed links off lj or what, but hello! Welcome to Lil's other space. And um, without trying to sound entirely conceited - because clearly fic is the hot topic right now - if that's what you were looking for, i don't keep it on here, it's at stowaway. If you want crazy PhD RL rambles though, this is where to get them. ;P)

[caz963]

Hi!

Yeah, I did delete the original because too many people seemed to be taking it the wrong way. Yes, it's something that pisses me off, and yes, in the grand scheme of fic "wrongness" it's a minor thing - but that was sort of the point. I wasn't going to go off the deep end about the crappy spelling, grammar and characterisation that exists in fic in general and in some D/D fics in particular, it was a personal bugbear that is nonetheless important when you consider that the coat - and Ten's outfit in general - is pretty iconic.
But I got fed up with the "oh well, fic's just a bit of fun", and "I'd hate to intimidate new authors like this" - because a) it's a bit of fun, yes, but part of that fun (to me, anyway) is getting it RIGHT and b) if a "new author" is going to get upset and put off by someone pointing out the difference between a cleaning cloth and an item of clothing, they need to grow a pair.
My original point was - yes, that coat might well be able to be called a "duster", we don't use that term in the UK. Like we don't use "sidewalk" or "elevator" or many other things.
I could have gone on about the frequency with which both Donna and the Doctor seem to bake "muffins" in fic - because we don't bake them with such regularity over here! Seriously, don't get me started on the muffins!!

*ahem*

Yes, I did friend you here - I have your fic journal friended at LJ anyway, and tbh, I'm not over here all that much. It's just that with the LJ wankery over the cross-posting I popped over here to tidy-up and re-import my LJ and remembered to add a few people. Besides, you seem like the sort of person who will take my rants in the right spirt :-)

[biodamped]

Yeah, i know exactly what you mean. There's a couple of things that irk me the same way - pet names that Donna has for the Doctor, for instance. I'm not British born but i have a largely British family, and Donna using Yorkshire slang is just.. so wrong. So wrong, which you will probably understand, but not a lot of other people seem to get. I totally agree that one of the most satisfying things about fic is that it exists to do what the episode didn't. If those characters aren't believable, it might as well be original, not fan, fiction.

Haha, muffins. The only person i know that b akes muffins with that disturbing frequency is me, and that's because cooking (read: baking specifically) is one of my coping mechanisms for academic work. Through semester, i am lucky to get away with only doing one batch of muffins a week.

Ahh, i see. I haven't logged into my fic journal in forever - since i joined up here, i think. Lj wankery is the primary reason i moved, not just because of Doctor/Donna. Site wankery in general was a bigger thing. I will, however, look forward to your ranting. I tend to do a fair bit myself ;) When i remember to update at all, that is. I've been promising a post-move entry for weeks now and all i can seem to do is blag on about Dollhouse pretty. Oops. :D